chess opening moves

Chess Opening Moves

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keiserpaul 55 ( +1 | -1 )
Thematic openings There are some specific openings - just as the Elephant Gambit, the Englund Gambit, the Halloween Gambit, .. - I like to study and to get more experience with. So I am looking for a way to challenge people to play just these openings with me. I first tried this with including this question in the heading of the "Start the Game" tool . Instead of asking "Let's play a game", I asked for "Who want to play 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 ?". The problem is that most people doesn't take care with my question and play other first moves.
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acne 18 ( +1 | -1 )
keiserpaul I think paulvalle is a good opponent for you. He plays different kinds of gambits. And I'm having a game with the Englund Gambit. What's the Halloween Gambit? The name is interesting =)
keiserpaul 27 ( +1 | -1 )
Acne Paulvalle indeed plays these gambits too. But with the same colour as I do. So he is not an opponent for me, but more a partner.
The halloween gambit is : 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nxe5 . Stupid ? Completely wrong ? Maybe, but ooh so nice to play the overwhelming attack that results from this offer.
acne 6 ( +1 | -1 )
That's very intriguing. I'm willing to play as black.
brunetti 16 ( +1 | -1 )
Dear Keiserpaul you can start games with the text "1.e4 e5 2.Nf3", and if the opponent doesn't play those moves you can cancel the game, option available until move 2.

wuzzer 7 ( +1 | -1 )
brunetti what are your thoughts about this halloween opening?
keiserpaul 7 ( +1 | -1 )
Ok Brunetti Thanks for the advice. I think this will solve my problem.
brunetti 9 ( +1 | -1 )
I think that a pawn and the developement advantage obtained for the Knight aren't sufficient.

zucan 13 ( +1 | -1 )
keiserpaul Why not play 2 games with paulville, one as white and one as black? That way, you both get the experience in using the opening and defending against it.
experiment2001 28 ( +1 | -1 )
I'm facing the halloweengambit right now. I have tried it a couple of times in 1 min blitz and the results have been positive. The best answer for black after:
1.e4 e5
2.Nf3 Nc6
3.Nc3 Nf6
4.Nxe4? Nxe4
5.d4 ...

definetly is 5. ... Ng6
and after 6.e5 Ng8
this I will play and I have no fear facing a situation like that.
philaretus 7 ( +1 | -1 )
Games played by agmac and myself... .....with paulvalle have established that 5...Nc6 is the better move.
keiserpaul 11 ( +1 | -1 )
Philaretus After playing and studying a lot of Halloween games, I do not believe Black still can win or even draw after 5. .. Nc6
experiment2001 2 ( +1 | -1 )
Hm ok On what basis?
keiserpaul 18 ( +1 | -1 )
Experiment2001 based on practical reasons. I never want to say that the opening is sound - of course it isn't - , but the practical results are in favour of White : the games I 've collected as well as my own ones do approve so.
philaretus 15 ( +1 | -1 )
keiserpaul I'd like to see an example of what you mean by 5...Nc6 being a losing move. If Black didn't follow up the move correctly, this proves nothing.
persianelephant 6 ( +1 | -1 )
Just about anything is good in 1 minute blitz. :)
atrifix 38 ( +1 | -1 )
I do not consider the Halloween Attack to be sound, and I believe Black should be able to win with either Ng6 or Nc6. That said, I have played this opening hundreds of times in 5-minute blitz or faster, and have a very good score with it :) Its correspondence value is suspect, however.

experiment2001 18 ( +1 | -1 )
5. ... Nc6 is very questionable if black wants to keep the knight.

That was also what I meant. My question was to philaretus. On what basis or on what line could Nc6?! equal?
keiserpaul 90 ( +1 | -1 )
Dear philaretus I do not think this discussion has any sense. I can give you an analysis, and you can refute it by giving a new line. Then I can refute this again by another new move. And so on. At the end you will win. Because unorthodox openings are not correct by definition.
Ok, I 'll give you a line out of my repertoire : 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Nc3 Nf6 4.Nxe5 Nxe5 5.d4 Nc6 6.d5 Ne7 7.e5 Nfg8 8.d6 cxd6 9.exd6 Nc6 10.Nb5 Qa5+ 11.Bd2 Bxd6 12.Nxd6 Kf8 13.Bxa5
An alternative is
6. .. Nb8 7.e5 Ng8 8.d6 cxd6 9.exd6 Qf6 10.Nb5 Na6 11.Bc4 Qe5+ 12.Be3 Qe4 13. Qe2
Are there better moves for Black ? Of course, there also are better ones for White.
I am playing chess for more than 40 years and I have played a lot of orthodox as well as unorthodox openings in that period. There is no difference between the results of my orthodox and unorthodox games. But one big difference is existing : I often win an unorthodox game, but I always lose the after analysis.
So if chess is looking for the truth, I am wrong. But I do not play for finding the truth, I am playing for fun. And attacking the ennemy king gives me more fun than pawn shuffling.
philaretus 39 ( +1 | -1 )
keiserpaul You don't consider either 6...Ne5 (as played by agmac) or 6...Na5 (as played by me). The games in question have now expired, but agmac obtained a superior position, which he squandered by unnecessarily cautious play. In my case, I reached the better ending, but lost through a blunder. I put it to you that these games don't support your claim that 5...Nc6 must lose. They should have gone the other way.
keiserpaul 14 ( +1 | -1 )
Philaretus No problem to consider Na5 & Ne5 :
6. .. Na5 7.e5 Ng8 8.d6 cxd6 9. exd6 Qf6 10. Nb5 Kd8 11.Qh5 g6 12.Qc5 b6 13.Qc7+ Ke8 14.Bd3 a6 15.0-0 axb5 16.Re1+ Ne7 17.dxe7 Bxe7 18.Bd2
6. .. Ne5 7.f4 Ng6 8.e5 A) 8. .. Ng8 9.d6 A1) 9 .. cxd6 10.exd6 Qh4+ ( 10. .. Qf6 11
Nb5 Kd8 12.Be3 Qxb2 13.Bd4 Qb4+ 14.c3) 11.g3 Qf6 12.Nb5 Kd8 13.Be3 b6 14.Qd5 Rb8 15.0-0-0 Bb7 16.Qd2 A2) 9.. c6 10.g3 f6 (10. .. b5 11.Ne4 Nh6 12.h4 Qa5+ 13.Bd2 b4) 11.Qh5 B) 8...Bb4 9.exf6 Bxc3+ 10.bxc3 Qxf6 11.Qd4 Qh4+ 12.g3 Qe7+ 13.Kf2

philaretus 10 ( +1 | -1 )
But the actual game went.... 6...Na5 7.e5 Ng8 8.d6 cxd6 9.exd6 Qf6 10.Nb5 Qe5+ 11.Be3 Nf6.12.Nc7+ Kd8 13.Nxa8 Bxd6

This counter-sacrifice gave Black the initiative.
keiserpaul 19 ( +1 | -1 )
Instead of 12.Nc7+ White can play 12.Qe2. Blacks development is still hampered, while White can develop freely. And after 12 .. Bxd6 13.Nxd6+ Qxd6 14.Bd2+ Qe6 15.Bxa5 I prefer the pawn structure of White.
brunetti 28 ( +1 | -1 )
In my opinion Nc6 is better, and Black has concrete winning chances. As stated, in blitz and lightning chess the relevant factor is the speed and results don't prove the goodness of an opening, but if we want to judge an opening we should deeply analyze it, "searching for the truth": this could be fun too (at least for me).

paulvalle 4 ( +1 | -1 )
The search for truth and perfection, will lead to a draw...